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| Subject: Vacouver Airport Investigation |
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Robert Dziekansk lost his life but what makes me sick is the current investigation TAKING PLACE. It shows a new immigrant quite happy arriving in the airport and moving around. Then within thirty seconds no discussion just ZAP him with the taser and a life ends.
NOW CBSA Officers are coming forward and claiming they did nothing wrong and that they assisted Robert Dziekansk and the CBSA staff are the good guys! If they had really assisted him he would not be dead.
I will never forget traveling through Europe and hearing all the different announcements in so many different languages. Canada is full of Ukrainians and Polish and most of those people are able to understand Russian so CBSA should of been able to better assist this new Immigrant and putting blame on others by pretending to be the good guys is not acceptable in my Canada.
WHAT WOULD BE THE COST OF A FEW BROCHURES EXPLAINING THE PROCESS OF EXITING THE AIRPORT USING A PAY PHONE, CURRENCY EXCHANGE, IN TWENTY DIFFERENT LANGUAGES? WOULD IT BE WORTH A LIFE?
SORRY MY MORNING RANT.
[01-04-2008,08:57]
[**.52.216.30]
Roy |
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(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
Roy,
Take my honest thanks for your sincere comments.
Human lives can never be recovered and none should go avoid such horendous responsibility for any excuse.
From my experience as a non English speaking immigrant I can tell that most of the first time immigrants landing in the foreign country feel scared mostly because of communication problem. They don´t understand most of the announcements (even who know english back home they can´t grab the accent here).
For a multi-cultural country like Canada it is well worthy to arrange announcements in different languages.
[01-04-2008,11:01]
[***.219.255.152]
DC |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
You are right, ROY. they never assisted him otherwise why would they kill him. A lot of money is spent on useless stuff and printing a broucher or displaying guidelines in different languages will not be much burden on the budget. There is no price, no budget and nothing more imprtant than an human life and we must do every thing to save a life.
[01-04-2008,11:09]
[***.50.205.242]
Mike |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
First time travellers arriving at their destination are always scared and sceptical. I am not sure what kinda impression that the guy had of the western world before he landed, well he could have been influenced by how his folks are living in Canada, God only knows what they told him to do and how to behave and throw in a few action scenes from hollywood movies in the mix and you have a total disaster waiting to happen yet again.
Tasers are dangerous, and thats the bottomline, according to studies undertaken 50% of the taser use was unwarranteed, and seems like this was one of those cases, the only thing to improve the situation will be better training of the officers. In the past 9 yrs over 150 victims have died in the USA and Canada because of taser stuns, probably much more than people executed by the death penalty ??? The U.N has already denounced it.
[01-04-2008,12:05]
[***.242.242.2]
Raj |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
I feel so sorry for the man... I just imagine him being my dad or my uncle, he looked just like any other decent man... perhaps he wore his best sport jacket to travel... my heart goes out to his family...
He was obviously going through some sort of panic attack or something... yes he was acting like a lunatic... but, I think no one made an attempt to comunicate with him to try to calm him down...
Did anyone try to find out where he was headed?... did he have family waiting for him?
My God! poor fellow...
I also feel bad for the officers... I know they were called to do their job... perhaps like others have said... police officers must really think twice before using this weapon... I don´t think that in this case, it was needed... come on there were what... 4 healthy, young, strong officer against a tired, sleep-depressed, unarmed old man!
[01-04-2008,13:15]
[***.229.242.146]
Lily |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
Raj,
Tasers are dangerous (though non-lethal) no doubt.
BUT here the main issue wasn´t that alone. To me, the main issue was how quickly the RCMP guys started using tasers before any other means. Why did they have to use tasers within 30 sec before tyrying simple physical techniques? They are supposed to train to lay down & secure any ordinary man within few seconds by hand alone. Here they were 3/4 I believe. Why taser instead of other means?
[01-04-2008,13:19]
[***.219.255.152]
DC |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
Hi DC, agreeing partly on the non-lethal part with you....
When the Tasers are tested, the subjects are people who are usually normal and have some idea that they are going to be "tasered". Medical experts disagree if that is a real test.... because when someone has a panic attack, there are a lot of things going on inside their body, high blood pressure and who knows what.... and the experts say that the tasers surely have a strong effect on the heart.... so I think the tests are not really on "real life" situations and the results are not acceptable as we have seen so many deaths by misuse.
[01-04-2008,13:44]
[***.8.159.170]
Raj |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
The earlier Video shows a happy relaxed individual. Regardless if Jail Guards can subdue criminals without any weapons why not the four big RCMP guys.
The other issue Lilly is why did this happen and why are now some saying they where so helpful that can not be disputed. If the CBSA staff where helpful this would not have happened.
[01-04-2008,13:51]
[**.158.53.207]
Roy |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
Yeah I think the RCMP guys should have overpowered him especially since he was outnumbered, and you know what happens in these investigations.... everyone tries to cover their stupid you-know-what´s. Hopefully measures are put in place to prevent this from happening in the future by now.
As Lily said I feel sorry for the officers too, as soon as they realized what they did, they must have have felt so bad for themselves, no matter what they say in front of public that it was the right thing to do or rules were followed or whatever.
[01-04-2008,14:21]
[***.8.159.170]
Raj |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
given I am the only one in Vancouver and the only one that gets the entire transcript in my paper or the full video clip on my TV...
You are all absolutely right - they should have never used the taser and I want to know the exact contents of the call made by airport security to the RCMP that would have them come into the facility ready for a fight.
The officers feel very badly for what has happened and I believe 2/3 are on stress leave.
the Airport staff also feel very badly - nobody is trying to hide anything and endless new measures have been added.
We also know that our dead man was given the wrong instructions by his family member about where to wait. We now know that security talked to the Mom in the waiting area and went into the secured area to look for Mr. Dziekanski but they could not find him.
in the last 2 days, under the FOI rules there has been new video released as well as transcripts.
Turns out this man did get some services in Polish, did get spoken to and assisted. Was it enough - no.
So, again, what happened that would spark his frustration and cause Security to make a rash phone call. We all want to know. Don´t forget, that was a 3 phase phone call - security to 911 to RCMP dispatch to officers that attended.
I really want to understand that conversation.
[01-04-2008,14:56]
[**.155.160.37]
Sharon |
(in reply to: Vacouver Airport Investigation)
In this matter my biggest surprize and frustration exactly there that I said already; echoing with Roy: "Regardless if Jail Guards can subdue criminals without any weapons why not the four big RCMP guys". WHY did they use taser within 30 secs of confronting him? That clearly tells me that they didn´t even care to try the other typical police work to overpower him. They tried to make their life easy. I´m always a great fan of Court TV and know that cops typically use taser gun as a last resort before firing or if they feel that they are out numbered or physically can´t control any robust suspect.
4 well trained RCMP guys had to use taser gun within 30 secs against one dizzy distraught person? They can´t avoid their sloppy work by any pretext.
It shouldn´t be the typical debate of how lethal the apparent non-lethal taser guns can be. Must be specific to why they used it so qucikly before trying other means.
What Roy said about taser guns are all true. They were never tested in field condition specially for guys with weak heart. 50,00 V may not carry lethal current but can be good enough to stop such weak hearts. In that sense if some one may be killed just with a moderate blow of old police batton in the right place. Comparison may not be the exact. If that happens the debate mustn´t be around how bad or lethal battons are.
I´m not sure where the official investigation stands now. Based on the scenario so far I saw, the officers (RCMP) shouldn´t deserve the jobs. Just feeling sorry or stress leave? No way.
That poor guys did something not right..given wrong instructions by the family...that all by no way sums up the price of a human life.
[01-04-2008,15:23]
[***.219.255.152]
DC |
